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Kommentar zu Lehles Artikel(13): Passagiere 27 May 2012 15:47 #2434

  • stefanlebkon
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Lehle schrieb:
Folgende Beweisstücke, die für einen Flugzeug-Einschlag sprechen, müssten, würde man CIT - Argumentation folgen, gefälscht sein:

1. Augenzeugen sowohl für ein Passagierflugzeug, das ins Pentagon fliegt (Quelle), wie Augenzeugen, die die Leichen der Flugzeugpassagieren noch auf den Sitzen festgeschnallt sahen

...
und 10. was leider zu oft weggelassen wird: Das Schicksal der Passagiere, Crew und der "Attentäter"
Kommen wir zum letzten Punkt:
Das Schicksal der Passagiere, Crew und der "Attentäter"

CIT Focus waren die Ereignisse am Pentagon, d.h. ob und was für ein Flugzeug auf welcher Flugbahn gesichtet wurde. CIT ging nie von der Prämisse aus, dass das Flugzeug, das über das Pentagon flog, AA77 war.

Das einzige, was wir wissen ist, dass AA77 um 8.56 Uhr, also 40 Minuten vor der Pentagonattacke in Kentucky von den Radarschirmen verschwand, so dass von einigen Stellen ein Absturz vermutet wurde
.

Die Flight Explorer- Daten konnten alle drei anderen Flüge von Anfang bis Ende verfolgen, nicht aber AA77
:



Dies wurde megrfach bestätig
t:

Washington Post:

http://a188.g.akamaitech.net/f/188/920/15m/www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/nation/graphics/hijack091101.htm

Times:



emperors-clothes.com/images/maptime.htm


Seattle Time
s:

The flights that crashed
On the ground, air traffic controllers watching Flight 77's progress westward suddenly lost touch with the plane, which disappeared from radar screens and cut off radio contact.

seattletimes.nwsource.com/news/nation-wo...flights_crashed.html

An air traffic controller at the FAA’s Indianapolis Center contacts the American Airlines dispatch office in Texas, and informs dispatcher Jim McDonnell that the center is unable to make contact with Flight 77 and does not know the location of this aircraft. The same controller called American Airlines and spoke with McDonnell four minutes earlier, reporting that radio contact had been lost with Flight 77 (see 8:58 a.m. September 11, 2001). McDonnell now says he has tried contacting Flight 77 but did not get a reply back. The controller then tells him: “We, uh, we lost track control of the guy. He’s in coast track but we haven’t, we don’t [know] where his target is and we can’t get a hold of him. Um, you guys tried him and no response?” McDonnell confirms, “No response.” The controller continues: “Yeah, we have no radar contact and, uh, no communications with him. So if you guys could try again.” McDonnell replies, “We’re doing it.” [New York Times, 10/16/2001; 9/11 Commission, 8/26/2004, pp. 30 pdf file] Flight 77 made its last radio communication with controllers at 8:51 (see 8:51 a.m. September 11, 2001), and deviated from its assigned course at 8:54 (see (8:54 a.m.) September 11, 2001). [9/11 Commission, 7/24/2004, pp. 8-9]

www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=...llsaa#a902faacallsaa

Frühestens um 9,21 Uhr beobachtet Dulles Airport ein Flugzeug, das ohne Transponderkennung sich vom Westen her Washington näherte:

www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=...rack#a930dullestrack


Interessantweise wurde erst sehr spät eien Verbindung zwischen dem Verschwinden von AA77 und dem Flugzeug, das Dulles Airport später beobachtete hergestellt:


Transskripte der Kommuniktion zwischen NEADS und Washington Center:
09:34:01

WASHINGTON CENTER: Now, let me tell you this. I—I'll—we've been looking. We're—also lost American 77—

WATSON: American 77?

DOOLEY: American 77's lost—

WATSON: Where was it proposed to head, sir?

WASHINGTON CENTER: Okay, he was going to L.A. also—

WATSON: From where, sir?

WASHINGTON CENTER: I think he was from Boston also. Now let me tell you this story here. Indianapolis Center was working this guy—

WATSON: What guy?

WASHINGTON CENTER: American 77, at flight level 3-5-0 [35,000 feet]. However, they lost radar with him. They lost contact with him. They lost everything. And they don't have any idea where he is or what happened.

911woodybox.blogspot.de/2007/08/where-wa...ht-77-after-856.html


Sogar Miles Kara, Mitarbeiter der 9/11- Kommission, räumt ein, dass AA77 von den radarschirmen verschwand, nach seiner Sicht für wengie Minuten:
December 17, 2011

Added two clips to “Audio Clips of Interest” to clarify the exchange between the mangers of New York Center and NY TRACON in which the Center told TRACON that they “may have two things going on.” The reference was to the fact that something had hit the World Trade Center and that they were tracking the primary target, American 11. Concurrently, however, as heard on the audio files, the controller for UA 175 made a floor announcement about the target that was UA 175.

Knowledgeable readers will quickly pick up on the fact that the time frame, 0852-0857 EDT, was concurrent with AA77 disappearing on radar several hundred miles to the west. No one at any level from the radar scopes to the President had even the slightest situational awareness. That was the state of affairs when, six minutes later, UA 175 flew into World Trade Center, South Tower. The surprise of the northern axis of a two-axis attack, each with two prongs, was complete. Chaos ensued
.

www.oredigger61.org/?page_id=2185


In einigen Medienberichten existiert für AA77 gar keien Flugroute, was darauf hindeutet, dass im Gegensatz zu den änderen Flügen ncith ersichtlich war, dass die Maschine, die am Pentagon gesehen wurde, AA77 war:

Cnn:



edition.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/trade.center/map.html

BBC:



news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/1544758.stm



Darüber hinaus gibt es berechtigte Zweifel, dass ,wenn überhaupt ein Flugzeug ins Pentagon flog, sich um AA77 handelte, d.h. einem siilbernen Passagierjet. Es gibt eien Diskrepanz zsichen den Beschreibungen von Zeugen, die von CIT interviewt wurden, und Mainstreampresseberichten. Diese Zeugen sprechen von einem WEIßEN Passagierjet, der auch in einigen frühen Medienberichten erwähnt wird:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=b22FtxlnzEA

Das Flugzeug, dass sich von Osten her Washington DC und dem Pentagon näherte musss also nicht AA77 gewesen sein.

CIT bevorzugt ein Szenario a la Operation Northwoods als Erklärung.
www.citizeninvestigationteam.com/faq-passengers_and_crew.html


CIt haben auch Recherchen zu dem letzten Manöver der Pentagonmaschine betrieben, die den letzten Abschnitt der offiziellen Flugroute in Frage stellen. Sie legen eine alternative Flugoute nahe, nach der das Flugzeug den Potomac River folgend vom Norden sich näherte, einje größere Schleife flog, in der sie auch in dem Luftraum von DC eindrang (was nach offizieller Version NICHT der Fall gewesen sein soll):
Man darüber hinaus sich als Leser Fragen, ob, wenn die offiziellle Flugroute falsch war, das Objekt, das sich von Westen über Washington näherte dann über überhaupt AA77 war, wenn das Flugzeug aus eienr anderen Richtugn kam oder ob sogar dasjenige, das Dulles Airport über Washington von Westen her kommend sah, dasjenige, war, das sich vom Norden her näherte,.


Hier die offizielle Flugroute. man beachte, dass das Pentagon sich westlich des Potomac befindet, d.h. in Arlington, NICHT in DC. Das Weiße Haus und das Kapitol befidnen sich östlich des Flusses
:




Kommen wir zu den Beweisen für eine alternative Flugroute, die die Herkunft des Pentagonflugzeuges wieder in Frage stellen:

Mineta bezeugt einen Anflug des Flugzeugs von Norden, in einem Interview von 2002, lange bevor die NTSB- Rekonstruktionen der Flugbahnen veröffentlcihet wurden:


So then someone came in, the same person came in and said, 'Mr. Vice President, it -- the plane's 30-miles out.' So I said, 'Monte, can you see it, and where is it in relationship to the ground?' He said, 'Well, that's difficult to really determine. I would guess it's somewhere between Great Falls and National Airport, coming what they call the DRA, the down river approach.'."


Great Falls befindet sich nördlich des Pentagon



Well, the question was where is it coming. And so as I was asking Monte, it was following pretty much the DRA, the down river approach, and it had not crossed over towards the White House or towards the Capitol. It was staying on its line towards what would normally be the traffic pattern into National Airport.


"And so then the person came in and said, 'Mr. Vice President, the plane's ten-miles out,' and so I said, 'Monte, where is it?' and he said, 'Well, I'm not really sure but I'd be guessing somewhere maybe between the USA Today building and, and National Airport.'."


Das ehemalige USA- Today- Gebäude befand sich damals nördlich des Pentagon.


Laut Mineta drang das Flugzeug in den DC- Luftraum ein:

And in fact, later on, in looking at the radar track, the plane had actually over-passed the Pentagon, then turned around and then came back into it, and it never took a wide sweep to cross over to the east side of the White House.

Quelle:

Interview mit Robert Hager 2002, NBC
web.archive.org/web/20071102131924/http:...0cb=-31a105678&cp1=1

Steve Anderson, der sich im USA- Today- Gebäude befand, berichtet, wie das Flugzeug an diesem Gebäude vorbeiflog
Shortly after watching the second tragedy, I heard jet engines pass our building, which, being so close to the airport is very common. But I thought the airport was closed. I figured it was a plane coming in for landing. A few moments later, as I was looking down at my desk, the plane caught my eye.

cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=1178.0


Ari Fleischer, Pressesprecher des Weißen Hauses, gab an, dass das Flugzeug in den Luftraum von DC eindrang:

Sources say the hijacked jet continued east at a high speed toward the city, but flew several miles south of the restricted airspace around the White House.

[...]

At the White House Friday, spokesman Ari Fleischer saw it a different way.

"That is not the radar data that we have seen," Fleischer said, adding, "The plane was headed toward the White House."


www.cbsnews.com/stories/2001/09/11/national/main310721.shtml

Dulles- ATC Danielle O'Brienn:

O'Brien went to the Pentagon to see what happened for herself, making her ever more certain that the Pentagon was a secondary target, and that the hijackers overshot or missed the White House.
"I've been down to the Pentagon and stood on the hillside and imagined where, according to what I saw on the radar, that flight would have come from," she says. "And I think that they came eastbound and because sun was in their eyes that morning, and because the White House was beyond a grove of trees, I think they couldn't see it. It was too fast. They came over that Pentagon or saw it just in front of them. You can't miss the Pentagon. It's so telltale by its shape and its size, and they said, 'Look, there it is. Take that. Get that.' They certainly could have had the White House if they had seen it."

abcnews.go.com/2020/Story?id=124266&page=3
abcnews.go.com/2020/story?id=123822&page=1


Col. Deskins berichtet, dass dass Norad den Radarkontakt mit der Pentagonmaschine über Washington DC verlor:

"we caught, on the radar scope, a few blips, maybe 7 or 8 (hands showing the spiral maneuver motion in correspondence with these radar dots), just enough to kinda go around in a half circle and then fade, eh - losing radar contact - RIGHT OVER um, WASHINGTON."


ab 15:20:

video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8721198283922671798

Colin Scoggins der ATC von Boston Airport und Verbindungsmann zwischen NEADS und FAA verortete das Flugzeug südöstlich des Weißen Hauses, d.h. im Luftraum DC:
Scoggins: Just to report, be advised the aircraft is 4-6 miles SE (southeast) of the White House.

Huntress: 6 miles SOUTHEAST of the White House?

Scoggins: Yup

Huntress: He's moving away?

CIT- Kritiker Erik Larson aka Caustic Logic kontaktierte Colin Scoggins bzgl. dieser Angabe. Laut Scoggins soll es sich um eine Beonachtung von einem Fenster des FAA HQ in Washington gehandelt haben:
was on aTELCON and there were people who were actually looking at their window and saw the plane, they were speaking it verbatim on the phone to the TELCON. So it was a visual encounter, I assume they were in FAA HQ on Independence AVE. I know one persons name who was there and according to a USA article on around 9/20/01 I have an idea who said it on the phone, and he is the same person that I received the Phantom 11 call on.�

�I don't know what office window they were looking from, I've always felt it was FAA HQ [�] I am 99 % sure that the statement was made by visual...

frustratingfraud.blogspot.de/2008/06/vis...-larson-caustic.html

Diese Beobachtung stimmt mit den oben gemachten Beobachtungen überein:




Der Pilot der C- 130, die kurz vor der Pentagonexplosion von DC aus Richtung Westen aus startete, berichtet:


"Well here's a chart of the Washington DC area...

That's Andrews Air Force Base right here...

We departed out of Andrews, climbed to 3000 ft which took us by the south side of the mall."


Narrator: Lt. Col. O'Brien was on a routine flight, but as he flew over Central Washington air traffic control reported an unidentified jet fast approaching on his left hand side.
...

Narrator: Flight AA77 descended in a wide turn over the Capitol and lined up with it's target there was a military C-130...flying above Washington DC



Auch viele andere Quellen geben an, dass das Pentagonflugzeug den Potomac überquerte und in den DC- Raum eindrang:
I talked to a number of average people in route who said they saw the plane hovering over the Washington Mall Area at an altitude lower that the height of the Washington Monument" (Bob) Hunt stated.
www.sierratimes.com/02/03/15/arjj031502.htm

Tom Hovis, realying what he had learned from reports: The plane had been seen making a lazy pattern in the no fly zone over the White House and US Cap. Why the plane did not hit incoming traffic coming down the river from the north to Reagan Nat'l. is beyond me.

www.beanerbanner.com/a_father____.htm
Joe Hurst: "I saw it go overhead, the plane."

-Oval Room restaurant at Lafayette Square.




[
/quote]

Gen. Clyde Vaughn: "There wasn't anything in the air, except for one airplane, and it looked like it was loitering over Georgetown, in a high, left-hand bank," he said. "That may have been the plane. I have never seen one on that (flight) pattern." Georgetown is a sector of the District of Columbia jammed with shops and restaurants - it is one of the city's most vital tourist draws. Commercial aircraft that are either approaching or departing from nearby Ronald Reagan National Airport do not fly over Georgetown, and rather trace their flight route over the nearby Potomac River,



[
b]
Joseph Candelario: As I was looking across the river towards the direction of the Pentagon, I noticed a large aircraft flying low towards the White House. This aircraft then made a sharp turn and flew towards the Pentagon[/b]
Stuart Artman, walking near the Washington Monument: "I saw the plane that hit the Pentagon. It went behind some trees."



Scott Cook: Later, we were told that it was a 757 out of Dulles, which had come up the river in back of our building, turned sharply over the Capitol, ran past the White House and the Washington Monument, up the river to Rosslyn, then dropped to treetop level and ran down Washington Boulevard to the Pentagon.

From E-mail: I remember reading a quote from a congressman at the time saying he saw the 757 approach the Capitol from southeast, make a "fighter-pilot
turn" directly over the Capitol, and head west before curving around
again
and hitting the west side of the Pentagon going east.



Quelle:

z3.invisionfree.com/CIT/index.php?showtopic=23

Auch die Washington Psot beschreibt dasselbe Manöver:
America's Chaotic Road to War
Bush's Global Strategy Began to Take Shape in First Frantic Hours After Attack

By Dan Balz and Bob Woodward
Washington Post Staff Writers
Sunday, January 27, 2002; Page A01

[...]

...American Airlines Flight 77, a Boeing 757 that had taken off from Dulles International Airport, turned away from the White House and flew back across the Potomac River, slamming into the Pentagon at 9:39 a.m.

www.webcitation.org/61611Boyx


Donald Rumsfeld:
Rumsfeld: Well, yes. But think about it, Sam. If the call came now -- let's take that plane. That plane took off from Dulles, I am told, went west, circled all around Washington. No one knew -- they knew it was off a flight path -- they had no idea where it was going --

www.defense.gov/transcripts/transcript.aspx?transcriptid=1886

Florida congressman says hijacked plane circled Capitol
]By Susan Cornwell
Reuters
Posted September 13 2001

WASHINGTON - The hijacked plane that crashed into the Pentagon two days ago circled the U.S. Capitol first and flew down the Washington Mall and over the White House, a U.S. congressman said Thursday, quoting police.

The comments by Rep. John Mica, a Florida Republican who heads the House of Representatives subcommittee on aviation, sparked a fresh flurry of speculation on Capitol Hill about a large plane that a number of witnesses reported seeing near the Capitol dome on Tuesday around the time of the terror attacks on the Pentagon and New York's World Trade Center.
...

Mica said the Capitol police had told him on Wednesday night that it appeared the plane that struck the Pentagon had been cruising around the area and ``had its choice'' of targets.

"The most disturbing thing is what I've learned in the past 24 hours, and appears to be confirmed, that one of the planes, the plane that hit the Pentagon, circled the Capitol building, went down the Mall at low altitude and then hit the Pentagon afterward,'' Mica said after a hearing of his subcommittee.

Ray LaHood of Illinois, backed up Mica's account, saying he had seen a plane flying low near the Capitol dome on Tuesday morning and he believed it was before the Pentagon had been hit.

"As I was crossing the street I saw a large passenger plane come into the air space very near the Capitol dome, circle around the west side of the dome,'' he said.

LaHood said he spoke to another congressman who was with him, and I said, I think this is awfully peculiar that a plane would be flying that pattern, I've never seen one fly that near to the Capitol.

web.archive.org/web/20020809065336/http:...sfl-913circled.story

.

Steve Chaconas wurde von CIT interviewt, er beschreibt ein ähnliches Manöver



www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5D2K19Y-aI



Auch in anderen frühen Darstellungen wird eine ähnliche Route angezeigt:

National Geographic bercihtet ebenfalls, dass daas Flugzeug in den DC Luftraum eindrang:



Quelle:
Seconds To Desaster
www.imdb.com/title/tt0972132/

www.youtube.com/watch?v=yfF12QaFw8U

Interessant ist auch, das diese Darstellung zeigt, wie das Flugzeug direkt über den Navy Annex fliegt, also auf der nördlicheren Flugroute, die die von CIT interviewten Augenzeugen beschreiben.





Man vergleiche diese Darstellung mit dier Flugbahn der CIT- Zeugen:




Warum dieser lange Exkurs zum Flugmanöver über DC?
Sie zeigen, dass es gute Gründe gibt, die offiziellen Rekonstruktionen der Flugbahn von Flug77 nach seinem Verschwinden von den Radarschirmen um 8.56 Uhr an der Ohio/ Kentucky- Grenze (also mehrere 100 Kilometer vom Pentagon enfernt) Zweifel zu ziehen. Dass das Objekt, dass sich dem Pentagon von Westen nähert,e aus einer leicht anderen Richtung kam (Nordwesten) wirft Fragen über seine Herkunft und Identität auf.


Dies lässt natürlich weiterhin offen, was mit den Passagieren, der Crew und den "Hijackern" geschah, udn CIT selbst schlagen uns Operation- Northwoods- Szenario vor, ohne näher ins Detail zu gehen.

Interessant ist zumindest, dass ein Großteil der Passagiere von AA77 für das Verteidigungsministerium bzw, die Rüstungsindustrie arbeitete:
killtown.911review.org/flight77/passengers.html

Auf 3 der 4 entführten Flüge befanden sich hochrangige Mitarbeiter von Raytheon, auch einer auf AA77. Raytheon ist eines der größten Rüstungsunternehmen und liefert auch Fernsteuerugnstechnologie
.

killtown.911review.org/oddities/911.html#Raytheon_passengers

Raytheon hatte auch Büroräume im WTC
:

truthmovecom.blogspot.de/2008/06/path-to...art-17-raytheon.html


Bei eingien Passagiere der Flüge würde sich neue Ermittlungen, lohnen.
Todd Beamer (UA93) arbeitete für Oracle, die von der CIA gegründet wurde und der noch immer CIA- Verbindugnen nachgesagt werden. Oracle- CEO Larry Ellison hatte erstaunliches Insiderwissen am 11. Septamber. Er wusste offenbar nicht von Todd Beamers Tod, sondern auch, dass er sich mit anderen Passagieren gegen die "Hijacker" erhob, bevor die Öffentlichekeit und auch Beamers Witwe von diesen Fakten erfuhren! Lisa Beamer wurde erst später vom FBI vom Anruf Beamers in Kenntnis gesetzt.
Oracle- Experten führten am 11.9.01 zufällig im WTC, genauer in den Räumen von Fiduciary Trust, eine Notfallübung durch. Fiduciary Trust spielt ebenfalls eine dubiose Rolle in 9/11:


www.medienanalyse-international.de/fiduciary.html
www.medienanalyse-international.de/kean.html
www.911-archiv.net/Hintermanner/648-Orac...and-Todd-Beamer.html



Kommen wir zum nächsten Punkt
:

Augenzeugen, die die Leichen der Flugzeugpassagieren noch auf den Sitzen festgeschnallt sahen
www.usatoday.com/news/washington/sept01/...14-pentagon-usat.htm
www.rense.com/general68/pass.htm

Es handelt sich hier wieder um dem Pentagon nahestehende Quellen bzw. Mainstreampresseberichte.

In beiden sind Armeeangehörige die Quellen, in der ersten wird der Zeuge nicht in direkter Rede zititert, was die Passagiere in irhen Sitzen betrifft. Außerdem enthält der Artikel die Falschinformation, dass ein Großteil des Rumpfes den Crash überstanden hätte:

Members of Congress who toured the site Thursday said rescue officials reported that much of the fuselage of the hijacked airplane remains intact in the ruins.


Die 2. Quelle, Capt. Ingledue ist da schon interessanter. Er will nicht nur einen intakten Pass eines der Passagiere gefunden haben, sondern eben auch Passagiere in ihren Sitzen festgeschnallt gesehen haben. Sein Verhalten war, wie er zugab merkwürdig, und erinnert an eine Person die versucht, ihren Kopf aus der Schlinge zu ziehen:

Capt. Jim Ingledue, shift safety officer of the Virginia Beach Fire Dept, said Monday he found amidst the rubble at the Pentagon, two days after 9/11, the perfectly clean and unblemished California ID card of Suzanne Calley, 42, one of the alleged victims killed aboard Flight 77.

"I remember thinking it was highly unusual and strange to find a perfectly intact ID card amidst all that devastation," said Capt. Ingledue, a Pentagon first responder who arrived two days after 9/11 and spent a total of seven days in search and rescue.

...

In a telephone conversation from Virginia Beach, Capt. Ingledue added the find was "so strange" he kept it in his pocket for an hour instead of immediately turning the evidence over to FBI agents like he was instructed.


Warum übergab er dem FBI den Pass nicht sofort?
"When we arrived at the Pentagon, we were advised to turn over any personal effects or possible evidence immediately over to the FBI," said Capt. Ingledue, who admitted the find was unusual, but doesn't subscribe to any wild-eyed 9/11 conspiracy theories. "I kept this bit of evidence with me a little longer, I don't know why, but I guess I thought it was strange to find an ID in perfect shape when everything else around me was devastated."


Er kann sich nicht mehr genau erinnern, warum er den Pass nicht sofort den FBI- Beamten übergab? Es ist auch nicht dokumentiert, wo der Pass gefudnen wurde. Laut eigener Aussage wurde erst 2 Tage nach 9/11 zum Pentagon gerufen. Kann es ncith eher so gewesen sein, dass der intakte Pass erst nach dem "Crash" und dem Kerosin- und Bürobrand an seinen Fundort gelangte?
Oder hat Capt. Ingledue ihn überhaupt im Flügel gefunden, wenn der Pass noch intakt war? Angesichts der Gedächtnisschwierigkeiten und seines eingestandenen "merkwürdigen" verhaltens kann man auch auch Fragen, ob Ingledue dem FBI den Beweis zusteckte...
Capt. Ingledues Aussage wirft zumindest viele Fragen auf und lässt auch die Behauptung, Passagiere in ihren Sitzen gesehen haben, in einem zweifelhaften Licht erscheinen.

Wir sollten uns nochmals eines Feuerwehrmanns in Erinnerung, den Lehle an anderer Stelle zitiert:


Denis Griffin . . . had been working in the aftermath of the attack all day, and seen wreckage that looked like it could be from an airplane, but there were so many wild stories going around that he wasn’t sure what to believe.

Es ist erwiesen, dass Vertreter der am Pentagon im Einatz befindlichen Behörden "wild stories" verbreiteten bzw. Aussagen macheten, die sich gegenseitig wirdersprechen
:

The Flight Data Recorder (FDR) was found early in the morning of September 14, 2001. Government reports indicate the FDR was found at the entrance hole of the collapsed E ring. "...the two spotted an intact seat from the plane’s cockpit with a chunk of the floor still attached. Then they saw two odd-shaped dark boxes, about 1.5 by 2 feet long....
They’d been told the plane’s “black boxes” would in fact be bright orange, but these were charred black. The boxes had handles on one end and one was torn open. They cordoned off the area and called for an FBI agent, who in turn called for someone from the National Transportation Safety Board who confirmed the find: the black boxes from American Airlines Flight 77. “We wanted to find live victims,” says Burkhammer. But this was a consolation prize. “Finding the black box gave us a little boost,” he says.



There´s quite a difference between them find ´a charred chunk of machinery and what is described above.
Note they were reported found at E Ring, the ´impact´ site.
The story gets changed to this :



Subsequently, FBI photographer Jennifer Hill finds the cockpit voice recorder in a stack of rubble while assisting searchers. Thirty minutes later, a National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) expert locates the flight data recorder in the same area. [Creed and Newman, 2008, pp. 396-397 and 400-402].


Then..


But Allyn Kilsheimer, a structural engineer who helps coordinate the emergency response at the Pentagon, later claims he had “found the black box,” which, he says, he had “stepped on… by accident.” [GW Magazine, 3/2002; Popular Mechanics, 3/2005].



Stepped on in a pile of rubble?


Washington FBI agent Christopher Combs says, “Somebody almost threw [the black boxes] away because they didn’t know what they looked like.” [Disaster News Network, 10/30/2002]


Throw evidence away? Who was this ´somebody´? And who told him/her what it actually was?


Allyn Kilsheimer makes another incredible comment:

Allyn Kilsheimer, a structural engineer who arrives at the Pentagon at about 5:00 p.m., later recalls: “I picked up parts of the plane with the airline markings on them. I held in my hand the tail section of the plane.” [POPULAR MECHANICS, 3/2005; GOLDBERG ET AL., 2007, PP. 100]


Allyn on steroids or what? And why to this day are there no photos of this ´tail section´?



z3.invisionfree.com/CIT/index.php?showto...w=findpost&p=2294085

Allyn Kilsheimer will die Heckflosse der Boeing in ihren Händen gehalten haben?


Noel Sepulveda will die Hijacker aus dem noch offenbar intakten Cockpit gezogen haben, obwohl nach allen offiziellen Darstellung gerade dieser Bereich durch den Aufrpall zerfetzt worden sein soll. Außerdem stellt sich die Frage, wie Sepulveda die Leichen als dejenigen der Hijacker erkannt haben will. Hatten sie noch intakte rote Stirnbänder auf?

covertoperations.blogspot.com/2010/07/no...washed-pentagon.html

Vgl. die Aussage im Pentagon Building Performance Report:

These data suggest that the front of the aircraft disintegrated essentially upon impact but, in the process, opened up a hole allowing the trailing portions of the fuselage to pass into the building."


fire.nist.gov/bfrlpubs/build03/PDF/b03017.pdf



Die letzte Veröffentlichung, die einen Bericht über das Auffinden der Passagiere in ihren Sitzen enthält, ist das Buch

Firefight: Inside the battle to save the Pentagon on 9/11 von Patrick Creed und Rick Newman.

www.amazon.com/Firefight-Inside-Battle-S...ntagon/dp/0891419055



www.911-archiv.net/Pentagon/1286-Pentago...en/Page-24.html#2192

A couple of quotes from Firefight:

"For the first time, Regan's team saw something they had expected to see all along but had been scarce until then: recognizable airplane parts. They all thought they would find big pieces of the airliner laying everywhere, the way car parts end up strewn across a highway after a crash. But the physics of an airplane crash were obviously different: Mostly there was just tons of shredded metal and melted plastic.

Finally, they found several airplane seats, piled among the usual mounds of upturned office furniture and random wreckage. A couple of the seats still had bodies belted into them, which had already been found and marked for the FBI. Most of the workers inside were conscientious about not gawking, yet the seats attracted a lot of attention. They were the first objects the nonaviation experts had seen that unmistakably belonged to an airplane." (Pg. 373)



forum.prisonplanet.com/index.php?topic=218005




Wichtig ist, sich des Hintergrunds der Autoren bewusst zu werden:
Creed is an amateur historian, volunteer firefighter, and U.S. Army Reserve officer who recently returned from a tour in Iraq as civil affairs officer with the Army’s Special Operation's Command. Newman is an award-winning journalist and staff writer for U.S. News & World Report.

Wieder ist ein Armeeangehöriger an der Verbreitung des Mems "Zeugen sahen Passagiere in ihren Sitzen festgeschnallt" beteiligt. Auch hatten die Autoren exklusiven Zugang zu Fotos bekommen, die zuvor noch nicht veröffentlicht waren. Warum diese Vorzugsbehandlung?
911sig.blogspot.de/2008/06/firefight-inside-battle-to-save.html


Interessant ist auch ihre Aussage, dass sie mit ihrem Buch nciht versucht haben, zu belgen was nun wirklich am Pentagon geschehen ist, sonderneinfach die Geschichten der Rettungskräfte und Ermittler wiederzugeben.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=osOauXe8QGA


Deswegen enthält das Buch wahrscheinlich auch "wild stories" wie:
"The punch-out hole . . . was created by explosive energy”.

Dass dieses Loch durch "explosvie Energie" entstanden sein soll glauben noch nciht mal mehr die Vertreter der offiziellen Version. Dies müsste den Autoren bewusst gewesen sein, da sie sich der Verschwörugnstheorien bei der Arbeit an ihrem Buch bewusst waren. Wurrd hier versucht, durch die Hintertür wieder die Raketentheorie in die 9/11- Skeptiker- Bewegung einzuschmuggeln?


Colonel Karen Kwiatkowski, who from her fifth-floor, B-ring office at the Pentagon, witnessed "an unforgettable fireball, 20 to 30 feet in diameter," was called for stretcher duty. She describes “a strange absence of airliner debris, there was no sign of the kind of damage to the Pentagon structure one would expect from the impact of a large airliner. This visible evidence or lack thereof may also have been apparent to the secretary of defense, who in an unfortunate slip of the tongue referred to the aircraft that slammed into the Pentagon as a 'missile'.


911sig.blogspot.de/2008/06/firefight-inside-battle-to-save.html


Sämtliche Quellen zu den Berichten über die Passagiere sidn mit Vorsicht zu genießen, da sie alle Militärangehörige sind, bzw. dem Militär nahestehen. Mindestens ein Zeuge ist dubios udn verdient eien eignehendere Untersuchung. Bei den anderen lässt sich zumindest eine tendenziöse Haltung zugunsten der offizieleln des Pentagon erkennen, angereichert mit Falsch- udn bewussten Desinformationen.

Auch die Fotografien der Leichen, die im Pentagon geborgen wurden, geben keinen eidneutigen Hinweis auf Passagiere in ihren Sitzen.
Obwohl es zahlreiche fotos von andere Flugzeugteilen gibt, exisitiert keien einzige, die einen Flugzeugsitz zeigt.
Im Moussaoui- Prozess wurden 4 Fotos von Leichen in Sitzposition veröffentlicht.


Quelle:

frustratingfraud.blogspot.de/2006/11/fac...aoui-edition_28.html

Bei diesen Leichen köntne es sich aber auch um Personen gehandelt haben, die während ihrer Schreibtischarbeit überrascht wurden:
The fireball occurred when the jetliner's full fuel tank exploded on impact and roared down corridors so fast that "90% didn't know what happened to them," he said.

Many were sitting at their desks or behind partitions. One woman was found frozen in a sitting position, her arms posed as if reading a document.

www.usatoday.com/news/washington/sept01/...14-pentagon-usat.htm

Zur DNA- Identifizierung ist zu sagen, dass die Frage bleibt, ob die Leichenteile de Passagiere vor tatsächlich Ort gefunden wurden. Blowfish hat zu Flug 93 einen guten Post geschrieben:

www.911-archiv.net/Shanksville/235-Coron...ally-Miller.html#402


Zumindest ging das Verteidigugnsminsitrium mit den Leichen von AA77 udn UA93 äußerst nachlässig um:
A report released by the Pentagon on Tuesday reveals that the remains of some victims of the September 11 terrorist attacks were incinerated and dumped in a suburban Virginia landfill.
This latest news comes as the findings of a Defense Department-led investigation into the alleged mismanagement at the military mortuary at the Dover Air Force base in Delaware are revealed to the press.
Last year, the DoD acknowledged that the remains of at least 274 fallen troops were sent to the King George County landfill outside of Washington, DC. At the time, the military estimated that more than 2,700 fragments of body parts were entered into eternal rest at the garbage dump around 70 miles due-south from the Pentagon. Now, say officials, victims of 9/11 were also disposed of at the site.
The report, released Tuesday, says that the remains of the passengers killed in two separate tragedies on 9/11 were sent to the landfill. Victims of both the plane that was downed in Shanksville, Pennsylvania and those aboard the jet that struck the Pentagon in Northern Virginia are some of those that were sent to Dover, then the landfill. Between the incidents involving both aircraft, a total of 223 people perished on September 11, 2001.
The Defense Department review reveals that several portions of remains� made it to the Virginia landfill, but does not specifically account for a number. The body parts in question, says the Pentagon, �could not be tested or identified� due to charring and other damages that resulted from the tragedy.

The report adds that mortuary officials first believed that, �after final incineration, nothing remained� of the victims. Reviewing the report, the Washington Post reveals that residual material from 9/11 victims did exist, however, which were handed to a �biomedical waste disposal contractor� hired by the Pentagon that then approved for the remains to go to the landfill.


rt.com/usa/news/victims-landfill-remains-mortuary-439/
09/12/02

Rumsfeld spoke next to a flag-draped casket containing cremated remains from the Pentagon rubble that could not be identified. For five of the victims, the internment in Arlington will be the only burial because no remains were confirmed to be theirs.

The five include a 60-year-old retired Army colonel and a 3-year-old girl killed with her parents and sister aboard hijacked American Airlines Flight 77.

...

In some cases, as recovery efforts continued, additional remains were identified after a person was buried. Some of their families chose to have those fragments held for the common burial site, Jennifer Lafley, spokeswoman for the Army Military District of Washington said.

...

All the cremated remains buried Thursday were determined to have come from victims, because they did not have a genetic trait shared by the terrorists, said Chris Kelly, spokesman for the Armed Forces Institute of Pathology.

Some of the remains buried could not be linked to an individual victim. Others were identified after a victim had been buried, and were included in the shared grave at the family's request.

The hijackers' remains were turned over to the FBI in February. Any other remains, such as ash, that could not be partially identified as victims were disposed of by the mortuary at Dover Air Force Base in Delaware, Kelly said, to ensure that no terrorists were committed to hallowed ground.



www.arlingtoncemetery.net/unidentified-091202.htm

Debra Burlingame, sister of Charles Burlingame, the pilot of the plane that was driven into the Pentagon by terrorist hijackers, said she was confused by the report. She said she attended a ceremony at Arlington National Cemetery at which unidentified 9/11 remains were buried in an engraved casket.

�They were treated with great respect and great ceremony,� Burlingame said. �The Department of Defense was exceedingly sensitive and treated those unidentified remains with great respect. ... I would want to know more.


The Abizaid report primarily focused on management reforms to a �dysfunctional, isolated� Dover mortuary chain of command. It cited the 9/11 matter while explaining the history of problems at Dover that came to light last year through complaints from whistle-blowers who revealed the mishandling of war remains.

The practice at Dover of cremating partial remains and sending them to a landfill began shortly after Sept. 11, 2001, the report said, �when several portions of remains from the Pentagon attack and the Shanksville, Pa., crash site could not be tested or identified.


The terrorist-hijacked airliner that slammed into the west side of the Pentagon killed 184 people, and the plane that crashed in a field near Shanksville killed 40.

The Abizaid report said that in line with Dover�s policy, �cremated portions were then placed in sealed containers that were provided to a biomedical waste disposal� company under Air Force contract. �Per the biomedical waste contract at that time, the contractor then transported these containers and incinerated them.� The report said Dover authorities assumed that after incineration �nothing remained.�

But a Dover management �query� found that �there was some residual material following incineration and that the contractor was disposing of it in a landfill.� It added that use of the landfill was not disclosed in the waste disposal contract. �We don�t think it should have happened,� Abizaid told reporters.



In the case of 9/11 victims, some remains from the Pentagon, where American Airlines Flight 77 crashed, were buried at Arlington National Cemetery on the anniversary of the attacks. Three caskets of unidentified remains from the crash of United Airlines Flight 93 in Shanksville were buried there last September.

In Pennsylvania, Somerset County coroner Wallace Miller said in an interview Tuesday that he was surprised that remains from Flight 93 might be involved in the new Pentagon report. �I wouldn�t know how there would be any possibility how any remains would get to Dover,� Miller said. He said the only remains he knows of that would not be in Pennsylvania are those of four of the hijackers that are being held by the FBI for potential military tribunals.


A lawmaker who has closely followed the Dover scandal, Rep. Rush Holt, D-N.J., said the Pentagon has yet to fully explain the practice of disposing of partial remains in landfills. �The Pentagon must provide absolute clarity and accountability as to what human remains were dishonored in this manner, and it must take far more aggressive steps to ensure this never happens again,� Holt said.
Holt also revealed that he had written to Panetta on Feb. 6 asking for a fuller explanation of the history of remains disposal by Dover. In the letter, Holt asked, �Regarding the aftermath of the 9/11 attack on the Pentagon, can the Air Force confirm that no 9/11 victim�s remains were incinerated, mixed with medical waste and sent to a landfill?�


www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2012/02/..._of_911_victims.html



Es gibt nur eine Grafik mit den angeblichen Fundstellen der identifizierten Leichenteile der Passagiere. Da sie aus der hand derjenigen Behörden stammt,. die wartscheinlich an der Verschwörung bzw. Vertuschung beteiligt waren, wie an der Manipulation der Radardaten. Sie ist sie kein Beweis dafür, dass Passagiere im Pentagon gefunden wurden


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Re: Kommentar zu Lehles Artikel(13): Passagiere 07 Jun 2012 21:04 #2441

  • stefanlebkon
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Einige der Experten, die bei der Identifizierung der Pentagonopfer mithalfen, waren auch an den Ermittlungen zum Waco- Massaker beteiligt.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waco_Siege

Die Vertuschung durch das FBI zeigt die für den Oscar nominierte Doku "Rules of Engagement" auf.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=pmOBNnz9Wms

Dieselben Experten waren auch an der Aufklräung der Bombenanschlags in Oklahoma City 1995 beteiligt, ei nEreignis, dessen offiziell Version immer noch viele zweifel und Fragen aufwirft und bei dem Verbidnungen zu 9/11 gezogen werden.
killtown.911review.org/flight77/fatalities.html

Zu Verbidnungen von Oklahoma City und 9/11
bellaciao.org/en/spip.php?mot133#pagination_articles
www.911-archiv.net/Insider/288-Oklahoma-...95-Connnections.html
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