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TOPIC: CIT und Überflugzeugen

Aw: CIT und Überflugzeugen 28 Sep 2010 16:06 #1048

  • stefanlebkon
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Die Originalquelle müsste noch ausfindig gemacht werden, doch spricht im Moment nichts gegen die Authenzität

Studio host (carol...?): We have an eyewitness who actually saw this event take place. They're on the phone with us now...Is it Mr. or Ms. Gurman?

Mr. Gurma: It's Mr. Gurma

SH: OK, Mr. Gurma, tell us what happened.

MG: I saw a big explosion, a ball of fire. My windows rattled and I looked out. There was a big ball of fire and there was smoke coming out. But [background unintelligible comment] I am looking at it right now. It missed the navy annex. It missed the pentagon. It like missed so many the high rise buildings. It head past the parking lot.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dh62Wpqw_To&feature=player_embedded
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Aw: CIT und Überflugzeugen 28 Sep 2010 16:10 #1049

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Interessant sind auch die Zeugenaussagen, nach der die Maschine kurz vor der Explosion wieder an Höhe gewonnen haben soll:

1. Robert Turcios

www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3RCBQKON_I&feature=player_embedded


37

2. "...I want to make it make sense. I want to know why there's this gap in my memory, this gap that makes it seem as though the plane simply became invisible and banked up at the very last minute..."

z3.invisionfree.com/CIT/index.php?showto...w=findpost&p=2293237
Last Edit: 28 Sep 2010 16:15 by stefanlebkon.
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Aw: CIT und Überflugzeugen 28 Sep 2010 16:14 #1050

  • Harry_B
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Red Dwarf schrieb:
Bei ihm erfolgt erst der Überflug Anflug, dabei rauscht der Laternenmast in seine Frontscheibe und er bringt den Wagen zum Stehen. Dann steigt er aus, begutachtet den Schaden und er beginnt mit Hilfe eines ausgestiegenen anderen Fahrers, das Ding zu entfernen. Und dann erst gibt es eine Explosion!
Ich habe mich schon immer gefragt, wie das zeitlich funktionieren soll... das wären doch noch deutlich mehr als 8-9 Sekunden.
Die weiteren Explosionen im Inneren des Pentagons sind unstrittig - strittig ist nur, ob die durch Kerosin oder durch Sprengladungen verursacht wurden.

Aber das ist ein ganz anderes Problem als: erst eine Explosion und mehr als 9 Sekunden später ein Flugzeug, das an der Tankstelle vorbei fliegt.
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Aw: CIT und Überflugzeugen 28 Sep 2010 16:22 #1051

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"Die weiteren Explosionen im Inneren des Pentagons sind unstrittig - strittig ist nur, ob die durch Kerosin oder durch Sprengladungen verursacht wurden."

Jim Hoffman schließt die Verwendung von Sprengsätzen zumindest nicht vollständig aus:



Shockwave
Eyewitness Accounts Suggest the Pentagon Attack Involved Explosive Detonation
Many of the over 100 eyewitness accounts in Eric Bart's compilation recall characteristics of the explosion that accompanied the September 11th attack on the Pentagon that are suggestive if not conclusive of the detonation of a powerful explosive device. Two such characteristics are:

A sharp detonation wave and silvery flash
The smell of cordite
These reported characteristics might not be explainable by the rapid combusion of jet fuel alone. Neither do they necessarily indicate the presence of explosioves, given the effects of a high-speed crash.


Flash and Detonation Wave

Air Force Lt. Col. Marc Abshire -- from in his office on the D ring, near the eighth corridor
It shot me back in my chair. There was a huge blast. I could feel the air shock wave of it. I didn't know exactly what it was. It didn't rumble. It was more of a direct smack.


Terry Morin, a former USMC aviator -- heard from the BMDO offices at the old Navy Annex
I saw the flash and subsequent fireball rise approximately 200 feet above the Pentagon. There was a large explosion noise and the low frequency sound echo that comes with this type of sound. Associated with that was the increase in air pressure, momentarily, like a small gust of wind. For those formerly in the military, it sounded like a 2000lb bomb going off 1/2 mile in front of you.


James S Robbins -- from office 1 1/2 miles from Pentagon
There was a silvery flash, an explosion, and a dark, mushroom shaped cloud rose over the building. I froze, gaping for a second until the sound of the detonation, a sharp pop at that distance, shook me out of it.


Jeff Anlauf -- from 14th floor of the Sheraton Hotel, located 1.6 miles from the explosion
Then, about 5 seconds later, the whole hotel shook. I could feel it moving.


Peter M. Murphy -- in Mr. Murphy's office on the fourth floor of the Pentagon's outermost ring, the E-Ring, overlooking the helo-pad
At that instant, a tremendous explosion with what Mr. Murphy said was a noise "louder than any noise he had ever heard" shook the room. Mr. Murphy, who had been standing with his back to the window, was knocked entirely across the room, while Hogue was jolted into his office.


Mike Dobbs --
Everyone said there was a deafening explosion, but with the adrenaline, we didn't hear it.


Noel Sepulveda -- in parking lot, over one hundred feet from explosion
For a brief moment, you could see the body of the plane sticking out from the side of the building. Then a ball of fire came from behind it. An explosion followed, sending Sepulveda flying against a light pole.


Master Sergeant Noel Sepulveda -- standing only 150 feet from the point of impact
... followed by an explosion; and the blast of the impact was so tremendous, that from his vantage point, it threw him backward over 100 feet slamming into a light pole causing him internal injuries.


SGT Dewey Snavelyles Fowler -- driving along Arlington's Quaker Lane
Then we heard an explosion and the truck rocked back and forth.


Navy Capt. Charles Fowler -- heard from inside the Pentagon
You could feel the building shake. You knew it was a major explosion.


Lt. Col. Ted Anderson --
We ran to the end of our building, turned left and saw nothing but huge, billowing black smoke, and a brilliant, brilliant explosion of fire


Cordite

Don Perkal --
Even before stepping outside I could smell the cordite. Then I knew explosives had been set off somewhere.


Gilah Goldsmith --
We saw a huge black cloud of smoke, she said, saying it smelled like cordite, or gun smoke.


911research.wtc7.net/pentagon/evidence/witnesses/explosive.html


Es sit interessant, dass mehrere erfahrene Militärs, die sich zum Zeitpunkt des Anschlags im pentagon befanden, aussagten, dass die erschütterung sich wie eine Bombenexplosion angefühlt und -gehört habe

(9:38 a.m.) September 11, 2001: ‘Experienced Combat Arms Officers’ at Pentagon Think a Bomb Has Exploded There

A group of Army officers at the Pentagon initially thinks that a bomb has gone off in their building when it is attacked. Army Major Craig Collier and his colleagues are in their office on the second floor of the Pentagon’s C Ring, about 200 feet from where the building is hit. Collier will later recall: “[T]he building jolted and we heard a muffled boom, then a rumble.… All of my peers in the area are experienced combat arms officers, and we quickly agreed that it sounded and felt like a bomb.” [Goldberg et al., 2007, pp. 26] Numerous other Pentagon employees also initially think a bomb has gone off, and apparently only a few guess a plane has hit the place (see (9:38 a.m.) September 11, 2001).

www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=...s#a938combatofficers


(9:38 a.m.) September 11, 2001: Some Officers in Area Where Pentagon Is Hit Think Bombs Have Exploded

At least three Pentagon employees in the area of the building that is hit, and who narrowly survive the attack, initially believe that what they have experienced is a bomb, or bombs, going off:
John Thurman, an Army lieutenant colonel, is in a second floor office just above where the Pentagon is hit. [Washington Post, 4/12/2006] He later describes the moment of impact: “To me it didn’t seem like a plane.… [T]o me it seemed like it was a bomb. Being in the military, I have been around grenade, artillery explosions. It was a two-part explosion to me.… t seemed like that there was a percussion blast that blew me kind of backwards in my cubicle to the side. And then it seemed as if a massive explosion went off at the same time.” He will add: “I had thought that perhaps the terrorists had surreptitiously gotten construction workers to come in and place explosives.” [United States of America v. Zacarias Moussaoui, a/k/a Shaqil, a/k/a Abu Khalid al Sahrawi, Defendant., 4/11/2006 ]
Lt. Nancy McKeown is on the first floor of the Pentagon’s D Ring in the Navy Command Center, which is mostly destroyed when the building is hit. [Washington Post, 1/20/2002; Goldberg et al., 2007, pp. 30-31] She will recall: “t initially felt like an earthquake.… It sounded like a series of explosions going off.… It sounded like a series of bombs exploding, similar to like firecrackers when you light them and you just get a series going off.” [United States of America v. Zacarias Moussaoui, a/k/a Shaqil, a/k/a Abu Khalid al Sahrawi, Defendant., 4/11/2006 ] She yells out to her colleagues, “Bomb!” [Goldberg et al., 2007, pp. 31]
Army Lt. Col. Brian Birdwell is returning to his second floor office, and is just yards from where the building is impacted. [9/11 Commission, 3/31/2003; Dallas Morning News, 9/7/2006] “Bomb! I thought,” he recalls of the moment the building is hit. [US News and World Report, 12/2/2001; Today's Christian Woman, 7/1/2004]

www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=...ed#a938bombsexploded
Last Edit: 28 Sep 2010 16:26 by stefanlebkon.
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Aw: CIT und Überflugzeugen 28 Sep 2010 16:26 #1052

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Harry_B schrieb:
Aber das ist ein ganz anderes Problem als: erst eine Explosion und mehr als 9 Sekunden später ein Flugzeug, das an der Tankstelle vorbei fliegt.
Mein Verdacht ist, dass sich selbst wiedersprechende Überflug-Zeugenaussagen in Umlauf gebracht wurden, um einen Überflug unglaubwürdig erscheinen zu lassen.

Dazu passt auch die Höhe laut Flugschreiber (durch Luftdruck UND durch Radarsensor vom Flugzeug senkrecht zum Boden gemessen) die ja auch eindeutig auf einen Überflug hinweist. :pinch:
Last Edit: 28 Sep 2010 17:09 by Harry_B.
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Aw: CIT und Überflugzeugen 28 Sep 2010 17:45 #1053

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Harry_B schrieb:
Harry_B schrieb:
Aber das ist ein ganz anderes Problem als: erst eine Explosion und mehr als 9 Sekunden später ein Flugzeug, das an der Tankstelle vorbei fliegt.
Mein Verdacht ist, dass sich selbst wiedersprechende Überflug-Zeugenaussagen in Umlauf gebracht wurden, um einen Überflug unglaubwürdig erscheinen zu lassen.

Dazu passt auch die Höhe laut Flugschreiber (durch Luftdruck UND durch Radarsensor vom Flugzeug senkrecht zum Boden gemessen) die ja auch eindeutig auf einen Überflug hinweist. :pinch:

Ok...

Versuchen wir also mal, die wahrscheinlichsten Elemente aller Aussagen zusammenzufassen, inkl. der Zeugen für Detonationen, die Stefan oben zitiert hat... rein hypothetisch, aber so, dass ein Sinn bei der Überfliegerei herauskommt:


So sah das Pentgagon einige Tage vor dem 09/11 aus. Der weisse Trailer steht genau vor Punkt X:


Nehmen wir also man an, der Trailer enthielt sowas wie eine Napalmbombe für den Showeffekt. Das gibt eine beeindruckende Flamme, eine Menge Ruß, aber keinen besonderen Explosionsdruck. Nehmen wir weiter an, daß der Bauarbeiter auf dem Dach 3 KM entfernt zwar diesen Feuerball sah, aber kein wirklich prägnantes Geräusch. Das Gehirn spielt einem da manchmal einen Streich...
Er sieht direkt danach das besagte große Flugzeug durch den Rauch über das Pentagon hinwegfliegen. Diese Maschine sieht dann auch
Taxifahrer Lloyd England, als die Laternenmasten durch die Gegend fliegen. Er hält an, steigt aus, ein anderer Fahrer kommt... und die Fassade sah zu diesem Zeitpunkt etwa so aus:

Was da qualmt, ist im Prinzip nur der Haufen vor dem linken Baum und der dunkle Generator-Trailer.

Weiter im Text:
Nun erst knallt es richtig im Inneren des Gebäudes, was auch Lloyd und die anderne Zeugen hören. Dies würde die zeitliche Diskrepanz zwischen dem Überflug der Maschine und der erst relativ lange danach erfolgten Explosion erklären. Es werden Sprengkörper gezündet, die das Gebäude in den unteren Etagen zerstören. Erst danach breitet sich im Inneren langsam ein richtiger Brand aus.

Einschlagstelle:


Dito, aber brennend:



Eure Ideen dazu?


RD
The basic rule of false flag and other disinfo operations is that, if you can keep your basic story in the forefront of the media for three clear days, it doesn't matter what is said after that: everyone will remember the original story as the truth. But this was before the days of the Internet.
Last Edit: 28 Sep 2010 18:05 by Red Dwarf.
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