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TOPIC: 9/11 Plane Crashs Investigation

9/11 Plane Crashs Investigation 02 Feb 2010 22:02 #448

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After September 11, 2001:
Unlike Previous Incidents, NTSB Does Not Investigate 9/11 Plane Crashes


In the weeks following 9/11, the National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) assists the FBI in its response to the attacks. Over 60 NTSB employees work at the scenes of the crashes—the Pentagon, Pennsylvania, and New York—and at the board’s headquarters in Washington, DC, helping to identify aircraft parts, searching for and analyzing the flight recorders, and assisting the victims’ families. [National Transportation Safety Board, 9/13/2001; US Congress. Senate. Committee on Commerce, 6/25/2002] However, unusually, none of the four planes that crashed are the subject of formal NTSB investigations. According to Vern Grose, a highly respected air disaster analyst and former NTSB member: “First of all, after any aircraft crash, the NTSB [normally] launches what they call a ‘go team’ within two hours and that go team will have up to twelve people on it. Specialists in airframe, in engines, in electronics, in human factors. And these folks all go to the scene—they isolate the scene. From that point on, it’s the NTSB’s responsibility.” But with the crashes on 9/11, Grose says, “it’s my understanding that it did not occur exactly like that. They may have launched an NTSB crew, but it never took the same course a normal investigation would have.” [Lappe and Marshall, 2004, pp. 40-41] The NTSB says that, because the four crashes were “criminal acts,” the FBI is consequently the “lead investigative agency.” [National Transportation Safety Board, 9/13/2001] Therefore, the NTSB will later state that it “did not determine the probable cause” of any of the four crashes, “and does not plan to issue a report or open a public docket.” [National Transportation Safety Board, 3/7/2006; National Transportation Safety Board, 3/7/2006; National Transportation Safety Board, 3/7/2006; National Transportation Safety Board, 3/7/2006] However, even under these circumstances, Grose calls the lack of NTSB investigation “unacceptable.” He says, “Though the NTSB statute states the leadership of the investigation will defer to the FBI, the NTSB has still completed formal investigations into crashes deemed criminal acts.” It previously did so, for example, in the case of EgyptAir Flight 990, in which a pilot crashed a plane in an apparent suicide attempt (see October 31, 1999). [Lappe and Marshall, 2004, pp. 41] The Pittsburgh Post-Gazette complains about the unconventional investigative process, specifically in relation to Flight 93, which crashed in Pennsylvania. It says that, while the NTSB is “a small government agency whose procedures are fairly open,” with the FBI instead handling the investigation, “everything, even the most minute details, are being kept under strict lock and key.” [Pittsburgh Post-Gazette, 11/4/2001] As well as the lack of an NTSB investigation, attempts at conducting a precise grid search of the Flight 93 crash site will be overruled by the FBI (see September 16, 2001). [Longman, 2002, pp. 262]

www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=...1nontsbinvestigation
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Aw: 9/11 Plane Crashs Investigation 02 Feb 2010 22:11 #449

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Three of Four Black Boxes from WTC Crashes Secretly Found?


According to two men who work extensively in the wreckage of the World Trade Center, three of the four black boxes from Flight 11 and Flight 175 are actually found during this month, but the public is not told. New York City Firefighter Nicholas DeMasi will mention the finding in a book published in 2003. He claims to drive federal agents on an all-terrain vehicle during their search and to see the found boxes himself. The Philadelphia Daily News will report on the story in 2004 when another rescue worker, volunteer Mike Bellone, backs up DeMasi’s account and claims to have seen one of the boxes as well. Spokesmen for the FBI and the New York City Fire Department will deny the claims of these two workers. [Philadelphia Daily News, 10/28/2004] In 2005, it will be reported: “A source at the National Transportation Safety Board, the agency that has the task of deciphering the data from the black boxes retrieved from crash sites—including those that are being handled as crimes and fall under the jurisdiction of the FBI—says the boxes were in fact recovered and were analyzed by the NTSB. ‘Off the record, we had the boxes,’ the source says. ‘You’d have to get the official word from the FBI as to where they are, but we worked on them here.’” An NTSB spokesperson denies that the FBI ever gave them the boxes. [CounterPunch, 12/19/2005]

www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=...s#a1001wtcblackboxes
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Aw: 9/11 Plane Crashs Investigation 12 Feb 2010 19:57 #466

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Shanksville- Black Box discrepanies:

"Flight 93
Jetliner Was Diverted Toward Washington Before Crash in Pa.

By Charles Lane and Philip Pan
Washington Post Staff Writers
Wednesday, September 12, 2001

Authorities late today recovered the plane's flight-data and cockpit-voice recorders, government sources said. These should permit authorities to reconstruct what went on in the cockpit during the flight."

killtown.blogspot.com/2009/12/govt-jump-...nouncing-flight.html

FDR officially found on 9/13 @ 4:50pm: www.post-gazette.com/headlines/20010913somersetp3.asp

CVR officially found on 9/14 @ 8:25pm: www.thepittsburghchannel.com/news/961094/detail.html

back in Black Boxes

hoodwinkedatshanksville.blogspot.com/200...-in-black-boxes.html
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Aw: 9/11 Plane Crashs Investigation 12 Feb 2010 20:06 #467

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Pentagon Black Box

Question of Serial Numbers:

NTSB Describes Importance Of Unpublished 9/11 FDR Part Numbers And Serial Numbers
www.911blogger.com/node/16089

9/11 Aircraft 'Black Box' Serial Numbers Mysteriously Absent
www.911blogger.com/node/14081

Timeline dicrepancies:

Pentagon 9/11 Flight 'Black Box' Data File Created Before Actual 'Black Box' Was Recovered?
www.911blogger.com/node/15636

NTSB Affirms Dubious Explanation For Pentagon "Black Box" Data File Time Stamp Discrepancy

www.911blogger.com/node/18294




Can The Govt Get Their Story Straight? - Location Of Flight Data Recorder

pilotsfor911truth.org/FDR_location_091607.html

Location of American 77 Flight Data Recorder - Part II

pilotsfor911truth.org/location_2.html
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Re:9/11 Plane Crashs Investigation 25 Feb 2010 17:53 #475

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September 11, 2007: ’Wall of Silence’ Surrounds 9/11, Says German Television Reporter; United Airlines Denied Permission to Film Flight 93 Wreckage

Zweites Deutsches Ferhnsehn (ZDF), Germany’s public television station, broadcasts an investigation into alternative accounts of 9/11 called “Mythos und Warheit: Der 11. September 2001.” The documentary concludes there was no government conspiracy behind the attacks but describes what producer Michael Renz calls a “wall of silence” when he approached officials for information. “When officials are asked about 9/11 conspiracy theories they react by barricading themselves. For example: one of the greatest mysteries about the attacks on America is the apparently empty crater in Shanksville, Pennsylvania. Where is the wreckage of Flight United 93? After asking United Airlines, we are told that the insurance company has the wreckage. But the responsible manager at that company is first in a meeting, then on a three-day business trip, which then becomes a several weeks-long intercontinental trip. During this time he cannot be reached by email or cell-phone—or so we are told by the secretary of one of the largest airline-insurance companies in the United States. After weeks and countless phone calls finally a brief answer: we do not have the wreckage. The FBI in Washington is in charge. The FBI press officer is surprisingly open and cooperative. There will be no interview about 9/11 but he will certainly give permission to film the wreckage. After all, the investigations have ended and there is no reason to exclude the public. Alas! The FBI no longer has the wreckage. It has been returned to United Airlines. Back to square one! Yes, we have the wreckage, says the airline after a new inquiry. But no permission to film. No reason given. All inquiries to government officials, and most to private companies, end this way. Apparently no one wants to have anything to do with 9/11.” The producer describes similar difficulties when he tried to obtain permission to film inside a Boeing flight simulator or when he approached New York officials to ask them about the fireproofing in the WTC. “But when we talk with officials off-the-record, many say a gag-order has been handed from the top. There is widespread fear of getting into trouble by talking.” [Hamburger Abendblatt, 9/11/2007; Renz, 9/11/2007]

www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a091107renz#a091107renz
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